Monday, 14 July 2014

Last Thursday’s Council Meeting Webcast so lots about Manston Airport airport’s online auction goes live and Senior Staffing at the Council.



I don’t often put up the same thing up her as I put up on the press release site, but I think this council meeting is an important one, so here it is.


With the airport issue, the more I see of the issues related to the cpo the more certain I am becoming that tdc is just the wrong council to be considering this.

In the first instance being the planning authority for Manston immediately puts them at a disadvantage, as any planning application they turn down there, to the detriment of the site’s value, is likely to increase the current owners compensation claim.  

This may sound cynical but I think if you manage to work out why the local Conservative MPs are pushing for a cpo by TDC and not KCC then you may have the answer to the problems surrounding the future use of Manston.   


Well here is the first really significant document that the council officers have produced about the cpo http://democracy.thanet.gov.uk/documents/s37716/Manston%20International%20Airport%20-%20CPO%20Indemnity%20Partner%20Process.html?CT=2 which seem to be saying a minimum time of 217 days from when the actually decide if it’s viable.
The airport’s online auction has gone live at http://www.ppauctions.com/auction.php?id=121

I will add to this if I get time.  

80 comments:

  1. Given that members have to stand when addressing the council the microphones are clearly inadequate for the task. The only microphone suitable is that of the chair, who speaks from a sedentary position. Cllr. Moores' speech was a particular case in point.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. EMBOB there is an irony here that the council on one hand say they can’t afford to replace the equipment, which so evidently works badly, while on the other they are embarking on what appears to be one of the most costly cpos ever to occur locally.

      Delete
    2. I guess they are hoping other parties will provide the necessary wherewithal to fund it. Or is there more to it than meets the eye?

      Delete
    3. I would expect that just the legal costs at this stage are more than they can really afford, but the real problem is that if they go ahead with a back-to-back buyer who would wind up the sole owner at the end of the cpo, I can’t see there is any way they could ensure that the site remained an airport.

      There are various amounts bandied around, but I don’t think that in recent years the airport has ever done better for the owner than an annual loss of around £3m, at the other end of the scale the profit for residential use is measured in £100ms and it is going to very hard to find an investor with the money that doesn’t realise this and wouldn’t be tempted to give it a go.

      Delete
    4. Where there's a will there's a way!

      So much negativity still.....

      Delete
    5. Michael,

      There are many, about 8,000 including two MPs, that do not share your doom laden ubiquitous outlook. These people have a refreshingly educated and positive approach.

      Delete
    6. If you mean the 8000 or so that signed the petition online I would just like to mention there was absolutely no vetting of the names and addresses of those 8000 also there was no geographical limit as there would have been had it been a hand signed petition handed into the Council.

      Delete
    7. Presumably you vetted all those that held hands around the Pleasurama site to make sure they lived in Thanet... Seems to me just sour grapes because the Manston campaign is the biggest one in Thanet EVER.

      Delete
    8. presumably the Save Manston group who organised that petition read the rules before they set it up. Why sour grapes I have never expressed an opinion on whether I support their cause or not, and what on earth has the Pleasurama protest got to do with you or do you support the developer's cause despite nearly 12 years of inaction on their part. You have made it very clear in past posts that what goes on in Ramsgate matters little to you so why get involved unless this is because the comment about geographical limit and vetting the names to ensure no duplications is a legitimate issue.

      Delete
    9. Where were the 8000 together with their families when Manston needed them as passengers? Its so very easy for anybody just to sign an online petition, even my dog can do it.

      Delete
    10. Barry, Dave & His Dog,

      As you please - but then you demonstrate my point - we all doomed in Thanet, doomed I tell ye! [with apologies to Dad's Army]

      Delete
    11. I support art galleries and football grounds, but that doesn't mean I want to visit them. I think of others as well as myself.

      Delete
    12. Barry, I care as much about Ramsgate as I do about Herne Bay and Sandwich, ie quite a lot but they're obviously not as important to me as the town I live in.

      Delete
    13. And (Dave), it's not as if I've been choosing other airports over Manston. I haven't flown anywhere since 2004-2005, and those were flights to & from Aberdeen, Gothenburg and Dallas. None of these places had flights leaving from Manston.

      Delete
    14. You have hit the nail on the head here Peter. Manston could never attract airlines that offered the variety of destinations that people wanted. What makes anyone think that Manston could in the future? The man that oversaw the successful development of Southend airport could see no future for Manston.

      Delete
    15. Peter & John obviously the subtle approach went over your heads. Jumping to the conclusion that I was having a dig at SMA is barking up the wrong tree.

      I was actually having a go at TDC for their rule breach which has now set a precedent as to what is allowed when they receive a petition. I am sorry you 2 didn't get it I may have to be much more pedantic next time.

      Delete
    16. Barry,

      Oh.. I see now. It certainly passed me by. Thanks for the clarification.

      Delete
  2. The video nasty has been the same for many meetings almost unintelligible and difficult to follow, it almost makes you think thats how they want it so people will not bother. But then that would be cynical.

    ReplyDelete
  3. So from the 6th August will I be able to call the police to eject the chairperson of any public council meeting that tries to stop any filming,recodring or the take of photographs of he meeting? Or will council officials do this for me?

    ReplyDelete
  4. Dave - I guess this is why those who are campaigning to reopen it are mainly looking at cargo flights.

    Barry - Do you know for sure that people outside Thanet have signed this, or is that just an uneducated guess?

    ReplyDelete
  5. Re signing a petition. If the cause is in your interest then you should be allowed to sign. For example, a KLM pilot who would lose his job if Manston closed. The cargo handler in Nairobi, the passenger who relies on KLM to get around the world but who lives in the USA. Extreme examples I know, but anybody who has an interest in keeping Manston open should be allowed to sign.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Peter I think you have an issue with reading the english language so I will say this slowly. my gripe is with TDC and the relaxing of their normal procedure and allowing the system of petitions to be open to fraud. to verify a "signature" you only have to confirm the email address is valid.
      On a paper submitted petition you have to confirm the postcoded address is valid so any with a postcode outside of Thanet is disallowed.
      So guess what 8000 "signatures" are much easier to obtain and TDC have already confirmed no checks bar valid email addresses were done

      Delete
    2. Well there you are, Barry, the petition is doomed!

      Delete
    3. strange John I thought it had already been debated in chamber. Now whether it should have been allowed is a different matter and now TDC have created the precedent we will see whether other issues get a look in.

      Delete
    4. So are you saying BMBofB that TDC should use local taxpayers money to buy and keep Manston open for the benefit of all and sundry? Including all those that do not live in Thanet but would rather have an airport anywhere but in their own backyard.

      Delete
    5. Iris Johnston has a lot to answer for. The rules are rules and if she can bend them for issues that she feels strongly about then she should be removed from the position of power. I would not expect TDC to bend the rules in favour of Ramsgate so why are they allowed to bend the rules against Ramsgate. I am going to start a campaign for her to be investigated and see if she has broken the code of conduct to favour something she believes in.

      Delete
    6. P OM just what are the rules: e-petitions on TDC website says they just need an email verified to see if it is valid, so Iris hasn't broken any rules. It does seem strange that say a 1000 "signatures" from anywhere in the country can trigger a debate in TDC's Council chamber. What next a 1000 "sigbatures" to build a prison on Ramsgate gasworks from those on the Isle of sheppey?

      Delete
    7. Thanks Barry, the rules were bent on the time allowed to submit the petition though its just a waste of tax payers money that could be spent on public assets.

      Delete
    8. If Manston were to open then it can hardly be restricted to those who live in Thanet Dave. Surely in the over all scheme of things Manston should become a profitable business benefiting Thanet by being used by "all and sundry", otherwise it will fail, again. Manston is where it is, You can hardly move it elsewhere to somebody else's back yard.

      Delete
    9. Someone who likes to hide his identity is going to start a campaign against Iris. This should be interesting...

      Barry, you're another one who's always negative. What is it about the old people of Ramsgate?

      Delete
    10. That's like saying we should have a say in the building of motorways in other country's and where they go and if they are built as we may use them one day. The real truth of the matter is all the people in SMA that come from Thanet will be better off without the airport at least as far as pollution is concerned also if Ramsgate were to boom as a result of no longer being on the flightpath it would have a knock on effect to Thanet. If Margate suddenly became the place to be and 100s of millionaires bought up all the houses I would not complain it would be good for Ramsgate.

      Delete
    11. Peter that's rich coming from a man who wants to bed Ann Gloag

      Delete
    12. I don't know Peter , why don't you ask yourself next time you look in your mirror

      Delete
    13. Barry - I'd never live in a place like Ramsgate.

      Purp - Surely that's a positive attitude? Make love, not war!

      Delete
    14. EMBOB thanks for the examples - what these people have in common is that their council tax wont go up if TDC are faced with massive compensation claims from the current owners, now or in a years time when the new owners say " sorry guys, but this airport is in the wrong place to make money can we build some houses?"
      I note Sir Roger Wail doesn't live in Thanet either

      Delete
    15. So if an MP doesn't live in a particular part of his constituency Marksman, he can't represent the opinions of those who do? And who is to say that our council tax will go up either. If Thanet prospers because of a thriving airport, whatever form it takes, then the long term effect on council tax will be beneficial to all. If houses are built then more schools, surgeries, even hospitals will have to be built at a cost to the general taxpayer anyway.

      Delete
    16. The point is that Roger Gale called on TDC to carry out a CPO whilst he pays his rates to Canterbury. I'm more than happy if anyone in the 'we must have an airport' camp is willing to indemnify me any rise in my council tax. As regards to your vision of Thanet becoming a prosperous area due to having a thriving airport - can I ask why this hasn't happened in the last 15 years?

      Delete
    17. Lack of will to make it happen is why Manston failed. Given the right approach, no pun intended for airfield buffs, Manston can succeed, but the way forward must be whole hearted, or not at all.
      What a load tosh. Sir Roger Gale is MP for Thanet North and is therefore fully justified in acting as he does. I'm sure that as a Canterbury council tax payer his voice carries as much weight as any other council tax payer in Canterbury, but in Thanet he is one of the two elected MPs and as such his voice counts for more. If MPs were restricted by who they pay their council tax to then nothing would ever happen.

      Delete
    18. This comment has been removed by the author.

      Delete
    19. 'lack of will' - nothing to do with geography or commerce then?

      Delete
    20. Marksman @ 10:18am.

      That's OK, I will indemnify you against any rise in your Council Tax. Please send me your name, address and proof of identity so we can complete the paperwork.

      Delete
    21. Why thank you John. Should that come to pass I will take you up on your kind offer.

      Delete
    22. Marksman,

      That's good, I'm always happy to be of service. In the meantime can you please send me your bank account details, plus PIN and passwords. This is on the advice of my Nigerian accountant.

      Delete
    23. If as much effort and money had been invested in Manston rather than the Turner Contemporary then perhaps things might have been different. And people would have paid to use Manston, rather than Turner, which is free.

      Delete
    24. Are you really thinking that manston hasn't had more money than the Turner because it has much more and its all gone with nothing to show and thats private money not tax payers money if it were tax money you could double it. Now why would you support a failed airport? for 15 years it has lost millions each and every year its been open the owners have done all they can to stop it losing money why wouldn't they have? Do you think they liked to lose millions? Is there a reason that you can think of for them to benefit while losing millions? Or do you maybe think that your better than multimillionaires in business? If so why are you not stinking rich and buying it out of your own pocket? There are some public building that could really do with the money that TDC are spending on seeing if Manston airport is viable some people really need TDC to stop and think would this money be better spent on the old or poor or disadvantaged.

      Delete
    25. A well thought out response Purple Om. Once I have got my breath back I will send you some commas from my punctuation store, paid for by courtesy of the English taxpayer.

      Delete
    26. You seem rather stupid if you cant answer the questions and just point out a spelling mistakes or where i need to put a comma.

      Delete
    27. Sorry Purple Om, I didn't realise it was compulsory to answer idiotic questions. However, in addition to the punctuation marks donated by John, below, I enclose some paragraphs:

      Here,

      Here,

      And here.

      Personally I prefer venison on my plate rather than on the hoof, but each to his own.

      Delete
    28. I see a cleaver discussion going on here but weather it’s getting to the hart of the matter witch to my mind is wether pointing SMA at petitioning TDC instead of KCC was a political move domed to failure or a realistic attempt to save Manston airport or alternately helping Purple Om with his righting skills witch wile worthy may be inapposite hear.

      Delete
    29. Michael,
      I dunno. What is the answer?

      Delete
    30. I have come to the conclusion That the people running SMA and other FB groups are the best people to ensure that Manston airport never reopens.
      In WW2 Winston Churchill had a chance to kill Hilter but did not take it believing that it would do more harm than good as he was so bad a running the armed forces.

      Delete
    31. Nostradamus lives again, he thought it was Hilter too. Operation Foxley was abandoned as you so correctly put it Om, because a new leader of Germany might have been better at running the army then Hitler.

      Of course you are fresh from your success at closing Manston all by yourself Om. How much did you have to bribe the owner to close it? did you give her her money back?

      Delete
    32. No, she will get 200x her money back if TDC get a CPO on it.
      I wonder how big and strong it makes you feel sitting at home insulting people on blog sites picking the smallest hole in anything they write? Is it because in the real world you would never say anything to anybody because your to afraid that your week and feeble body might break? Or maybe you feel a little upset at the thought of the builders at Manston making something worthwhile for Thanet so you feel the urge to be bitter nasty and spiteful to anybody that does not hold your views.
      Well EMBOB?

      Delete
    33. This comment has been removed by the author.

      Delete
    34. I think Om that for many years the anonymous on here have been battered just because they are anon posters. there have been many over the years and all have come in for abuse. Its the nature of the medium. please do not take it personally all are treated the same.

      typo corrected

      Delete
    35. Thanks Barry but there only seems to be 3 trolls on here all old enough to know better, the rest of the comments are fine. I know there is no getting rid of them but it greats on you after a while and stops a good debate. I bet you can guess who I'm talking about.

      Delete
    36. So Mr Om, she will get 200x her money back. I make that £200.

      With regards to insults Om, you are not slow in dishing them out yourself. You have called me stupid, warned John Holyer to look after his "hart" sic, and many more, too numerous to mention. I have lived in the middle and far east and recognise the mentality of the lower orders in your rants etc. Perhaps when Manston is open again you will swallow your pride and be on the first flight out of Thanet, never to return. Of course I have made an assumption and perhaps you actually live in Arizona.

      Delete
    37. EMBOB the troll you refer to has reappeared but so far only on Facebook, funnily enough in his real name, and has recently joined two Manston groups. He lasted 3 days in the 1st and 24 hours in the second before they got fed up with his histrionics and kicked him out.
      It is fun to watch but he is now so obvious that I am surprised he lasts that long

      Delete
    38. Having re-read your comments above Om, have you looked in the mirror lately?

      Delete
    39. Perp,

      You really are the most atrocious hypocrite. From the outset you have poisoned your posts with insults directed at those who disagree with your point of view. Lashing out like the unruly curmudgeon you are. Then you whine when others reply in kind.

      I think you enjoy insulting people, while imagining yourself to be a hard hitting political agitator, a keyboard warrior. But in reality you are nothing more than a foaming, ranting banshee of cyberspace.

      You set out to play dirty. You have wished me an early death from cancer and persistently threatened me with a heart attack. Presumably because these are the two afflictions that you fear the most, and that you judge others by your own low standards. As I have told you before, you are the kind of person who would stab his best friend in the back just so you could write something vile on his tombstone.

      Delete
    40. John and EMBOB
      You have picked holes and insulted everybody for ages then when I say that your heart must be full of poison to be so bitter you say that im the one who has insulted you. Both of you are suffering senile dementia and are to far gone to use a computer. Like I have said before when you have been insulting PLEASE don't say anything to me again or comment on my comment's then we wont have this childish stupidly

      Delete
    41. Really Mr Om, if you can't take what you dish out then perhaps you who should refrain from making inane remarks on this and any other blog you come across. I don't know how old you are but I have been surfing the internet since 1992. As for childish stupidity I rather think the boot is on the other foot.

      As far as using a computer, I don't know if you have heard of the Sinclair ZX81, but I built one back in 1981 and it worked first time, That was when some thought was required to use a computer, unlike today, when every Tom, Dick and Harry can use one. So think on Om.

      Finally Om, you don't have to read my comments.

      Delete
  6. And I think you have a problem using the English language nicely.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. And just in case you don't understand "snap" Peter I would think from the many comments I have seen on Thanetonline complaining about your use of the English Language that many others have a problem with your use of it.
      there is a saying "if you can't take it don't dish it out" but then you can't see a problem!!

      Delete
  7. Perp,

    Help yourself: , , , . . . ,, ;;;; - please let know if you need more.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Perp,

      You admonish me to think of my hart. I find this curious bearing in mind that a hart is a deer. I do not have a deer. But Perp, you can rest assured that should I ever get a hart then I would think about it constantly; feed it and take it for walks to Manston to eat the grass and watch the planes. Now perp, about your brain.............

      Delete
  8. John I saw this and thought of you if you have trouble following the link then get one of your grandchildren to help
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3MF6bLIWJiY

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Saw this and thought of you Om. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d_hZtr-eSnU

      Delete
    2. Perp,

      Thank you, we're all challenged by your unique point of view.
      You're nobody's fool, but perhaps someone will adopt you.

      Delete
    3. Perp,

      Thinking isn't your strong suit, is it? If you ever had a good idea it would be beginner's luck. In fact you're so stupid you'd get hit by a parked car.

      Delete
    4. EMBOB,

      Magnificent! I heard that this nightly border ceremony is no more. Sad.

      Delete

Please note comments that may be libellous, comments that may be construed as offensive, anonymous derogatory comments about real people, comments baiting internet trolls, comments saying that an anonymous comment was made by a named real person, boring comments and spam comments, comments in CAPs will be deleted. Playground stuff like calling real people by their time stamp or surname alone, referring to groups as gangs, old duffers and so on will result in deletion. Comment that may be construed as offensive to minority groups is not allowed here either, so think before you write it, remember that the internet is a public place, that it is very difficult to be truly anonymous and that everyone who uses it leaves a trail of some sort. Also note the facility to leave anonymous comment will be turned of during periods when I am unable to monitor comment, this will not affect people commenting who are signed on to their blogger accounts. When things are particularly difficult on the commercial spam front I may turn comment moderation on for periods.

If you feel that someone has left a comment that is offensive and directed at you personally please email me (link on the sidebar) asking to have it removed, you will need to tell which post and the date and timestamp of the offending comment. Please do not reply to the offending comment as I will assume you continuing the dialogue as meaning that you want the comments left there.